30/07/2015 at 21:37 #1189
Feeling stuck in a rut here sometimes. On one hand, I’m pretty low on the computer-side of this game, and it affects my (lack of) performance when we play the one time a week. Though it doesn’t help when…
…I’ll PM that thought to the powers that be.
So, rather than complain, as it looked like I was about to. I was keen to see if I could get a go ahead to start writing stories in-character, usually during the ‘down time’ between missions.
I come from the old Play by E-mail Star Trek sims, and I dabbled in Battletech and Star Wars fiction as well. It helps me keep some interest and it’s my strong-suit as far as skills go. I’m a writer; Big surprise, since I don’t talk loudly or often.
As it is, I don’t feel much connection to the game, and I really have 0 concept of my character and the setting we’re playing in. In fact, I’m not even RPing here, if I’m honest. It’s just ‘myself’ remembering my Army days, and spouting some Navy terms/pressing buttons.
That’s not RP, it’s more like Cosplay but with computers. Complay? *facepalm*
Anywho. Usually when I write I already know the setting and how to fit in with it. But like I wrote before, I have 0 clue as to how life in the Galaxy at-large is here. What specific species are part of this USFP? What day-to-day technologies do we have? How prominent are computers/AIs? Do some of the species have offspring? (You know Humans think that.) I was looking to be a half-human, for instance. And of course not from Terra itself. What species lives where? And what extra/intra-solar worlds are around? How is the TSN structured, beyond the ships bridge officers?
Could come up with most of this on the fly, but I prefer to keep things with some sort of ‘guidelines’ to work from. The ‘writers reference’ if you will. Write a screenplay for a show, you’ll know what I’m talking about.
Actually, as I’m typing this, I do have to ask if we have more of a backstory in general? If not, maybe some of us writers (Am I the only one? Hope not.), could start brainstorming and writing in more information for the ‘Universe’ section of this website. It’s been blank/bland far too long.
Kind of keen to explore this place, and make a mark where I can. This is the only way I know how to, since I’ll never afford the hardware, and I don’t know jack about programming to make the actual game fun for you all.
Or is this just a pipe dream of mine? Let me know how stupid an idea this is, or if anyone would actually read stories, or cares about the fictional stuff out of the TSN game. Could all be for naught if you ever get into another bridge simulator game out there with a different universe. *shrugs* But it’s my time to waste, eh.
My sum up: I want to be constructive.30/07/2015 at 23:58 #1190Fish EvansModerator
Please be constructive and help us!
We do have some cannon around the place, read up on the bits that are filled in in the Universe and Campaing sections of the site there are a few personal logs from the Captain of the TSAF Asimov that can be found here I know there are some bits pending approval form Xavior/Command Staff as well – I know Lenard has a treatis on Jump points thats on that list.
there are only two USFP races that we have run into in missions to my knowlege:
Normaly Abhore Violance and are pacifists, very smart particualy with Jump Points and Gates.
Gas giant dwellers not really intrested in space but very good at building light weight but very strong structures (as there buildings float and theres not much easily obtained building materials). Currently looking to establish a colony in a new solor systme
my advice is write a bit on a subject you like and send a sample to any of the command staff (Xavior/Alice/Gomric/Me etc) Hell Im looking for some articals to pop into an upcoming news bordcast. and there are a couple of posible articals that I would like to appear over the next few weeks as we get ready to kick off a new “season” of the RP story. the theam being “Real Politica”.31/07/2015 at 00:05 #1191ZephyrParticipant
all OOC for this 🙂 , I’d take it as if it’s not defined before hand we all as the community make it happen, I just looked but my ‘menu’ must have been on the old server. We all can use these forums to create the backstory which can then be used to create the missions and the expand the backstory 🙂 As for breeding with the aliens, have you seen a skaraan female lately? I do like to have a bit of role play banter on the Saturday but your right we should make use of this forum to expand the role play aspect. To that end I’d ask the question is it possible to add pics or picture links here?31/07/2015 at 02:31 #1192
As far as writing stuff is concerned.
Being a good contributor to TSN content myself, I’d say go for it; you might think of something that would never have come otherwise. That said, fluff that gets written ends up under the microscope(like my unreleased thesis on Jump Theory), so when you do write content expect it to get some critique and/or take forever to be implemented fully. In regards to an ultimate “writer’s reference” for TSN canon there isn’t really any at the moment besides the collective knowledge we’re able to draft up from our own minds and some select other sources.
As far as encouraging RP is concerned.
Wardroom section on the CommNet is intended for in-character discussions and posting,and is where inter-shift RPing would naturally take place (except no such thing happens sadly). As for RPing just before and during the shift, I’d like to see more than just our casual not really in-character discussions, where we actually get involved in doing our day to day jobs and not just setting up for the next sim/mission. There’s got to be some stuff to do.
If you want to be a non-human TSN officer with your character, I’d love to see that happen. Good to note in that department however that the overwhelming majority of TSN officers are humans, compared to civilian traffic and the TSAF which sees a stronger share of non-humans involved. Doesn’t mean you can’t do it, though!
— LTJG Hall, Office of Naval Intelligence
// Wow, I sound like a senior officer writing in this style.31/07/2015 at 03:09 #1193
Ta Zephyr for reminding me to add this is all OOC and such. Just saw ‘development’ and reckoned this was a better place to suggest something.
As you wrote: “We all can use these forums to create the backstory which can then be used to create the missions and the expand the backstory.” <— That’s one aspect indeed.
Ah Fish. I was starting to get into those Asimov logs you linked. Were only two done back in Feb?
That’s one way to go for sure, with anyone’s character: Short personal and/or duty logs. Even if it’s just once a week. Easy for almost anyone to write.
Heck, I just learned we send in probes to unknown sectors! (Wish that was in-game, so mint.)
As to writing some stuff and sending it to you all. I was looking at the Universe and Campaigns section of this site. That’s what got me thinking to breathe some more life into this group you’ve all kept going for two years. Really not much there to go on right now.
[Edit, just saw Hall’s post as I finally posted mine. Microscope is fine. I’d love to get some ideas flowing on what is what. As to the RP part, I’ve heard mention of a ‘checklist’ we could have, to do character fluff.]
Let me give an open example of something I’d post character-wise, and why I’m looking to also expand the Universe knowledge that is next to nil. I’ll keep it in the format of the Asimov posts. Anything in ( ) are questions that need information.
Duty Log, Ensign Solari, (Position on ship here. Like who’s the Chief Weapons or Science officer?? Do we have Assistant or Deputy Chiefs, or whatever in a department structure? Or is everyone listed as ‘whatever specialty’ officer on the ships in-character roster?), TSN Hydra BC-016, 4-LD
So much for a relaxing escort assignment, for all of the division after yet another conflict. The TSN is being blamed for poaching some of the stellar life forms around Atlantis command. The Arvonians don’t seem like the kind to be easily duped, as Humans say. However, recent developments seem to indicate otherwise.
We lost two ships in an adjacent sector and probably only managed to rescue a fraction of the crews, in our rescue ops last shift.
I wasn’t in my usual station, as emergencies go, and so only had the comms system to go on.
Search and Rescue is not easy in the depths of space. Found a new appreciation for communications, and just how limited our current capabilities are. A request for non-hostile communications protocols would go very far. We need to do more than taunt or ask for surrenders on ships that might go hostile. Diplomacy is a decent enough form of communication. Looking back, I realised I could have helped avoid a further escalation of hostilities, if the Captain had been able to respond to the allegation of poaching in the first place.
It’s a far cry from my days as a Crewman on the TSN Neptune, before I took up the Officer Cadet programme. Still glad I did it though.
I’m not privy to much of what’s going on, so I can only give my best wishes to the recovery of the people we rescued.
To end off, I’ve helped our newly promoted Lieutenant junior Fulvus with removing all of the P-shock munitions from inventory, until we figure out how the pirates have been hacking the newer command systems. Like most everything else, that’s above my pay-grade. (Do we have a currency system? Credits?)
End duty log.
I once heard an expression that puzzled me until today. Captain Dunsel. For the longest time, I thought it was the name of an actual Captains in the TSN. Had to research the linguistics database to figure out it was some mid 20th century Human term, for something redundant and useless, because of a upgrade.
Well, I’m no Captain, so Ensign Dunsel seems more appropriate. Haven’t made a formal request as of yet of this though, but I should make my concerns vocal for the record. Maybe think them through.
Since being assigned to the Hydra, I’ve had very low moments when the Captain is on duty, and some of my better ones when the XO takes command. If my species had hair, I’d be pulling it out.
Note to computer, please look up the humour database to see if I got that right. (Do we have Star Trek like computers, or more low-tech style ones?)
It’s very odd when I look forward to the shifts the Captain is not in command, so that I can do one of my actual duties. For the record though, I admire our Captain. Follow her out of a super nova if we had to. Let’s hope I never have to test that theory out though.
On a related note, I’ve been looking over the specs of the Destroyer class. A few simulations on one have been quite enlightening. If the 4th were ever to commission a new hull, I’d be the first to request assignment in a…what do Terrans say, a heart ache? A heart pulse? Oh, heart beat.
End personal log.
Right, lousy examples. Normally I’d put in some more fluff, or write in the third person like a story, but first person works. Again, I don’t know this setting so I’m on unsure footing here, and limiting myself.
Just writing this makes me wonder about the little things. Do we have quarters? How big or small? Do we bunk at lower ranks? How is food made? What’s our tech level? (Dystopian, cyberware, retro-Fallout style?) What do our ‘characters’ see and actually know, when we play the duty shift? What happens on the lower decks? (I’m going off the assumption I’m a prior enlisted petty officer, on the mustang track, since my character is older then 20-something.)
Making sense or non-sense? 😛
31/07/2015 at 05:24 #1195
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Solari. Reason: New post, I didn't read
Let me try to beat these down. (word wall inbound!)
(Wish that was in-game, so mint.)
Probes and deployable objects are a thing and they were mostly used in Euphini.
(Position on ship here. Like who’s the Chief Weapons or Science officer?? Do we have Assistant or Deputy Chiefs, or whatever in a department structure? Or is everyone listed as ‘whatever specialty’ officer on the ships in-character roster?)
There’s no solid correlation so far between official positions on a TSN vessel and the position specializations, but you’d be best safe going off with something based around your primary and secondary combination, or one or the other.
(Do we have a currency system? Credits?)
The USFP uses a unified system of credits. When you have fusion power and replicators all over the place, currency as wealth tends to fall in favor of energy and merit as wealth though.
(Do we have Star Trek like computers, or more low-tech style ones?)
USFP computers, I’d say, are pretty similar to Trek’s LCARs in capability, though the general design, style and function of such machines would vary a good bit more in the USFP.
“Do we have quarters? How big or small? Do we bunk at lower ranks? How is food made?”
Yes, all TSN ships have relatively cozy quarters. Well, about as cozy as individual beds or bunk beds barracks’d next to each other can get. Personnel quarters aboard TSN stations are generally better accomodations than those on ships. Food generally gets made by replicators if you aren’t bringing something in made by hand planetside. To get an idea of the interior of a Light Cruiser, see this:
(Dystopian, cyberware, retro-Fallout style?)
Following the general Trek vibe that Artemis tries to capture, the USFP and by extension TSN is pretty technologically advanced compared to its neighbors. It doesn’t lead the curve in every department but we have our edges. It’s all pretty flashy and capable stuff no matter which race you go to.. except maybe the Kraliens.
“What do our ‘characters’ see and actually know, when we play the duty shift?”
Initially, before and during the startup of the duty shift, you’re on the division’s current base station with your fellow crewmen. Eventually you move over to your ships when the sims and active missions happen and everything gets moving. I’ll try and do a look by channel:
Parent channel (TSN Comms Hub)
Space! Unlucky sods getting an increase in their pay grade get kicked out here.
Personnel at the docking bay are generally observing the traffic, if any, coming in and out of the base. Basically resembles your typical airport terminal of the 2200s, and is a common breeding ground for new, incoming transfers to the Division; expect a regular DO to get very used to this place. Expect plenty of security/customs officers roaming around too.
Commissioned Officer’s Galley
The galley is the main place for junior officers to eat their food, as you’d expect. In most station and ship galleys, you’ll find a pretty utilitarian, lunchroom-style place for discussing all the various happenings on the frontier. Replicators will line at least one wall, and you can go get a wide variety of dishes from there.
The Head (AFK)
Out of character, this is the place where AFK crewmen tend to go to do their business unless it’s some other thing. In character, yes, this is a space bathroom, get used to it. Toilets for men, women, and xenos.
Toilet Cleaning Detail
Making bad choices and getting yourself disciplined means you need to spend some time to clean all those dirty toilets. Look where your mouth got you!
Senior Officer’s Wardroom
The private, secured wardroom for the senior officers is a very lavish place for a military ship, fulfilling both the role of lounge and place for the senior staff to cool down after a mission. A replicator is mounted in a pretty inconspicuous area and in general the place is kept pretty tidy.
Meeting Room (OOC)
This has no IC connotations; it’s the out of character meeting room for post-shift mechanics and issues.
Fleet Captain’s Quarters
Quarters of Fleet Captain Xavier Wise. I’ve never been in his quarters so I don’t know what it looks like in there.
Each briefing room is a properly fitted auditorium of sorts, equipped with a board and podium to allow the mission commanders to provide briefings to personnel about to head out on mission. Don’t expect incredibly comfortable chairs even on command bases, and expect to be standing up in the briefing room in 90% of situations.
Anytime someone does something in the briefing rooms it makes me think of Wing Commander.
Office of Naval Intelligence
Within the command sector of each station lies the local ONI adjunct. The main hub of each ONI adjunct is a pretty cool meeting office where ONI officers sit around and discuss the latest intelligence.
Intelligence Analyst’s Office
On staff with ONI is a number of intelligence analysts who assist the division’s field officers in running intelligence operations. I can really only best describe this part of the department as a set of private offices(sometimes cubicles) and the equipment strewn about them.
Department Head’s Office
Office of Commander Fish Evans, ONI department head for the division.
Meeting Room (OOC)
OOC meeting room for ONI business.
Where ONI officers go to interrogate captured enemy personnel. What, were you expecting the division’s donut supply to be locked in here? No.
Stellar Warfare Academy
TSN Officer Cadets who have cleared their basic ruts in the Academy and have arrived at the Division serve under the auspices of the SWA. The SWA adjunct is a professionally kept section of each station intended to house and perfect cadets as their first tours of duty start to beckon.
SWA classrooms are kept in proper accordance with Academy procedure and feature typical classroom accomodations. Cadets are briefed here before reporting to the Simbridges for simulation assignment.
A secured room within each SWA adjunct is the Exam Suite. A secured computer without CommNet access is used during testing of officer cadets attempting to secure their commission.
SimBridges act as the main simulation platform for cadets on station, using the same software and layout as a proper TSN bridge on a starship. SimNet on a station is kept localized from the Division’s CommNet so cadets can be rigorously trained without interfering in Division OPs.
Research and Development Department
Each R&D adjunct aboard TSN stations is effectively a massively upscaled version of the labs found on TSN ships. Mad science happens here and you should tread lightly.
Mission Operations Deck aboard TSN stations handles coordination, command, and control of all operations in the sector. Plenty of machines are operated by CIC personnel in order to keep situation nominal.
Mission Briefing Room
A special briefing room is located on the Operations Deck. Before active missions are launched, the crew assigned to them is briefed here.
Command and Control Deck
Above the Mission Operations deck is the CIC deck. Here, the mission control operators run the proverbial “switchboard” and direct active missions. CIC is linked directly with TSN Command and can interpret orders for the division at a moment’s notice.
When you are serving aboard your ship, you head down to it, obviously. While your ship is out doing missions, it is an isolated body — don’t try to go back to the station if you don’t have an EVA suit, haha!
Ships may get various “lower decks” below the bridge usually for IC-based AFK’ing. Other stuff could happen down there, though.
(What a word wall.)
31/07/2015 at 05:52 #1199
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Leonard Hall.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Leonard Hall.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Leonard Hall.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Jemel Eahain.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Jemel Eahain.
Wall of text it might be, but most of this needs to be added to this website in some form or fashion, if anyone like myself wants to understand the immersion factor here and write stuff.
The interior of the light cruiser was eye opening. Do we have the other classes of TSN ships interiors, or anyone working on them?
I should echo Zephyr’s request of more pictures/links on this site.
So I’m getting the vibe the tech here is more Star Trek, then say Babylon 5, Wing Commander, Star Wars, Warhammer, etc. See it’s helpful to know what kind of society the USFP is. Again Star Trek with merit over credit.
Replicators and fusion power. And here I was thinking we were still using only perishable/grown foods (coffee maker references galore!), and fission/nuclear power to fuel our ships. Learned something new, ta for that.
Kind of got the TS room descriptions, but we really don’t roleplay in them to this level of detail. Saw one of the ships had an Engineering deck last week; was wondering about that.
But for writing I can see this being useful information, as locations for stories and events.
31/07/2015 at 08:39 #1201Jemel EahainModerator
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Solari. Reason: Why does my post look squished? :/
Love the logs solari,they make very interesting reading.
regarding tech it’s something no one has ever really asked about, most just make it up as they go along.
some things are just taken as a given like most people refer to replicators etc for food but never in much detail.
ages ago I started a project making deck plans and drawing out ship systems and how I imagined they worked, some of that made it to the website most is sitting on my g drive waiting on me finishing it.
like people said if you have ideas get pen to paper and passed to a command officer,
Just a heads up on how it’s been with getting ideas through, there used to be a command staff who worked things out for the community but with 2 many points of view nothing got done, so it was shrunk down to division c.o. making the calls, thats fine but with real life it can take a while to get through things and approve them. Now the division is going back to a command staff(of similar view of the big picture) that should be communicating mid week via forums etc and meetings to get stuff flowing again.31/07/2015 at 11:40 #1202
So it turns out that accidental left-alignment I did halfway through that word wall, or the sheer length, or a combination thereof completely destroyed the formatting on all future posts. Damn.
Yeah, the USFP ( United Space Faring Planets for those who didn’t know already) is a pretty obvious Trek knockoff that you’d see coming from a lightyear away, but it has its own flavor of course and I wouldn’t discount the ideology of other franchises creeping in.
There’s also the plans for the Allegiance Battlecruiser ( mislabeled Aegis in the file itself)
and the Intrepid-class Scout
These are at least the ones I’ve been able to get pinned down from my drive history, as Jemel’s never made an official repository for these babies.
— LTJG Hall, O.N.I.31/07/2015 at 14:48 #1204Gabriel WadeParticipant
Actually Leonard, the Aegis Class deck plans you have there are for the Battleship, not the Battlecruiser. The giveaway is the 4x 2TW Beam Emitters. An Allegiance Class Battlecruiser has 2x 2TW Beam Emitters and then 1x long-range, high-powered beam canon(? I’m not sure what it would be called in tech speak, LOL). I know because I’m the one who OOCly designed the Battlecruiser. 🙂31/07/2015 at 16:14 #1205XavierKeymaster
Right, Hall is to blame for messing up the formatting on this thread. I’ll try to sort when I am back from R&R, unless Jemel can in the meantime.
On topic though: there are a lot of ideas about our canon floating about. There are a couple of conflicting ideas, but much is in a similar vein. Everything on the site is approved and official, and although pretty much ‘this is how it is’ it is not completely final. The liklihood of it changing is very low indeed though. I have made that decision so we have consistancy and we don’t end up flitting back and forth.
As I have most of my time freed up now, it is the time I really want to push on with developing canon. Until September, I have little to no work to do. Projects this summer therefore include developing canon as well as the TSN Sandbox.
This forum was set up to discuss and gather ideas that include development of canon. I will be picky though (I’m looking at you Hall!) and the Command Staff will also be involved in discussions about canon.
We did have more originally, but sadly lost a lot of it when our site changed. Some of it was recoverable, and some hasn’t been re-added. There is a bit of a backlog in that regard, that I hope to catch up on.
Next week I intend to be online Wed to Fri evening, and will dedicate a lot of my time to developing the site. If people can gather everything the have together for then I can review it and start posting stuff up. I won’t just be doing a ‘copy and paste’ exercise though. Stuff has to fit what we have already and the universe we operate in. There are lots of things to develop already (make sure you trawl the site and glean as much as you can) and we are sticking relatively closely to much of the established Artemis canon.
Like I say, at the moment I am away, so am limited to a phone, a notebook and paper (which I am using!) When I am back though, this stuff will start to develop further and get posted on the site.
Our first phase of establishing core stuctures and routines to enable smooth and enjoyable play seems to be set and running well; the next real phase therefore will be really developing the depth of our universe.31/07/2015 at 19:04 #1211Fish EvansModerator
There where a total of 5 Asimove logs, I stoped partly becuase I was haveing issues getitng them done (it became a busyy mounth for me) and partly becuase there where some complaints about the TSN/USN one upping each other on the main forums. heres a link to number three. I think the Next/Previous links work from there to the end.
and yes probes and deployments happens in mission, it wasnet THAT effecive becuase it had to be a GM controlled action (so the ship would report it was deplying a probe and the GM would operate some controls that would launch the probe near the ship.) Im thinking about repokeing the deployment system again for soem of the upcoming missions/arcs.31/07/2015 at 21:15 #1212
Now this has been some good feedback from everyone. Love this sort of inter-action and the wealth of ideas and statements.
Xavier, I realise this is your project, on the whole, so I’m sure as heck fine with getting everything OK’d by the powers that be, if we can help in any further developments for the TSN. And balls that most of the information is either fragmented on someone’s drive, or lost. :/
All of us Ensings/Cadets can’t do anything ‘official’ via an assignment, according to the TSN rules, so writing our experiences in-character, and ideas out-of-character and engaging each other, is a small step in retention for newer (and older?) members. And it might give some insights into how we all see our characters, or what we did on the duty-shift for feedback. Could even be important for people who can’t make every Saturday and still want to show they’re around in general.
Personally, I stay away from the ‘main’ forums, for a game, because I’m not looking for drama or conflicts from other groups. What’s done on this forum, is for us, by us. No complications and no upstarting anyone else. But that’s the place you go to advert and see what’s going on. (Scary stuff.) Thing is, the more that’s here, the more I want to stay here. One thing that can be alluring is a well constructed and active website.
Fish, you should consider starting up the logs again on this site. Anyone else keen? I love reading them, and now I’m psyched to write as well.
Could we create a sub-forum in the Wardroom, specifically for character logs? I’d love to start after our next duty shift, but perhaps more story-like then simply logs. (Or however Jemel and Xavier wish that to happen or be posted.)
We could follow Fish’s format, or whatever ‘official’ TSN approved one Xavier likes.
I take it R&D would be a place to help Hall (and Xavier, heh.) with TSN lore/backstory/technology fluff, as well as whatever game coding you’re doing? Sounds like you’re going to need more heads there. Reckon that’ll have to wait then, since that’s Lt and above stuff.
This is a whole other side to the group, beyond the game and it’s mechanics and pressing buttons. Best part is, it doesn’t change what we do on Saturday, and I hope might make some of us feel like we’re a part of something like a real organisation. Err, a fake real one. You know what I mean? 😛31/07/2015 at 22:28 #1213ZephyrParticipant
My thoughts again 🙂
-Any ‘checklist’ has to involve real in game items. There is enough there to do it properly, adding saying things for the sake of saying it detracts from the fact we are all involved in flying a ‘real’ ship. Keep to stuff like weapons “tubes active” when loading an EMP or whatever the captain has as a default loadout. “Manover and impulse systems fully operational” from helm with appropitate changes if it’s a bit glitchy.
-Have you tasted replicated food??? The real thing is far better 🙂
-As ensigns and cadets keep RP chat to stuff on your ship, once you’ve been in a bit longer extend your roleplay additions further, by that point you should have an idea whats out there and have had chance to look through the other background material. But it’s never bad to remember “Zephyr is AWESOME” 🙂 that always goes down well 🙂 with me anyway.
-As for adverts I’ll keep you posted about some real world advertising hopefully soon 🙂
-remember the main point is to have fun and give all the players a chance to have a good fun experience. For some that will be a lot of time spent on this beyond Saturdays for others Saturdays is all they can do/willing to do. This could be the hard balance, enough RP to be imersive but not to much as to alienate casual players.31/07/2015 at 23:09 #1214
As far as storywriting and fluff-making is concerned, it generally falls under ONI. R&D’s main jurisdiction is in regards to making new models and coding the scripts needed to make the stuff ONI dreams of run.
If you want to write fluff and missions, go ONI.
If you want to write code and design stuff ( more OOC stuff), go R&D.
— LTJG Hall, O.N.I.
- This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Leonard Hall.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.